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Jun 19, 2026
Relationships Before RFPs: Why Connection Still Drives Business
Relationships Before RFPs: Why Connection Still Drives Business
00:00
51:12
Transcript
0:00
Okay, so this is Daily Check-In with Russell of Hotels with special guest Miss Tiffany English. She's always here on Mondays, so we're just talking about her weekend.
0:08
And the Daily Check-In is about that, like, you know, j- uh, just checking in and, and seeing what she did over the weekend or anything that's pressing that we need to talk about, like anything that has to do with- Right...
0:20
uh, you know, service, selling, um, you know, Tiffany has a lot of gripes with people. You know what I mean? So we wanna get that stuff out. [laughs] We wanna air that stuff out.
0:30
Oh, you know- Or if we, or if she went to a nice restaurant, what she just said, and, and Miss, um, Kimberly Dupree's? Dupree. Dupree. Okay. So I had to ask her how to pronounce it, so now that I know, I keep, you know.
0:42
Okay, with Al Hi. Okay. With Al Hi. A lot of us know what Al Hi is. So, uh, they were, you know, got together over the, oh, on Friday and had lunch and stuff like that.
0:52
C- uh, of course, Tiffany's big on, you know, having lunch and having other people pay for it, so that's a good thing, so. Wow, Russell. [laughs] You're just gonna put me out there like that? [laughs] Okay.
1:02
Well, I- You don't like getting invited places? I love to be invited. Okay then. I love to be invited. Okay. But- And then we're here talking about it. Okay. Okay, we're talking about- But it was business.
1:10
It was business. What- I, I got to learn- Oh, interesting... a little bit more about Al Hi because honestly, and I told her about this, I'm like, "Are y'all educating planners about what you actually do?"
1:22
'Cause I think I have an idea in my mind, but they have all these different ways of really connecting with planners that I wouldn't have known. I, I asked her, I'm like, "Is this a secret club?" Like, [laughs]
1:34
like am I not- No... am I not supposed to know? No. She's like, "No, they just don't overwhelm and bombard, um, planners." But they have a l- and I think I told you, um, I went to their showcase a couple weeks ago.
1:46
Mm-hmm. Um, you know, Al Hi has a collection of luxury properties, so you have to be vetted to be part of this membership. And so they had, um, you know, properties in a showcase, um, in Chicago.
2:00
Um, you know, The Peninsula was there, L'Atlantis was there, um, Hotel Nico in San Francisco. So just a, a whole different, you know, variety. Mm-hmm. Um, and then you knew they were all vetted.
2:10
They were all either, you know, a high caliber luxury or they were all, you know, rated either, you know, four diamonds. So it was really great to
2:20
have those properties for specific programs that you knew you needed to be an upscale property. So they do that, but I, uh, I found out they do other things.
2:29
They have, um, like executive type conferences, um, for different types of niche, ni- niches of, uh, industries. Mm-hmm. Um, I know niche, niche. Um, and then connecting with the planners.
2:42
They have, you know, other client events. They have fam trips. So I feel like the... I know. I feel like it was secret. I'm like, how do I, how do I not know about stuff? So.
2:52
Well, how do they d- did you ask how do they work with planners and how do they make it? I- How does Al Hi get paid? So- That's a good question...
2:59
we, did we talk, I feel like we talked about this last time because you were like, "Make sure you ask this question." You and I talked about- Oh... I think it was, I, I think it was off air. It wasn't- Okay. Okay.
3:09
Well, let me explain because I told her that. I said, "You know, we kinda lump you in as, you know, in a group where other, these, these consortiums and these memberships, um, you know, take a commission."
3:21
She says, "That's a misconception. They don't take any, uh, any commission." They are, they, they are like, they represent the hotel like a GSO.
3:33
So basically they oversee, you know, the needs of a program, um, for independent, primarily independent hotels. Well, so what you're saying, and I had, and sorry, sorry to cut you off- No...
3:44
but what you're saying, 'cause I'm trying to understand. So what you're saying is they're the, they could be the sales arm or an extension of the sales team of XYZ hotel. Is that what you're saying? You know what?
3:56
Yeah, absolutely. Sales team and then it kind of feels like a little bit of CVB-ish or destination management. Ooh, CVB. I know. [laughs] Yeah. Because- Let's get a little bit of this and that... yeah.
4:07
Because they do steer into, you know, because they have that collection of properties, they're gonna, you know, really, uh, give you a list of what properties work, and they're gonna be honest.
4:18
They're gonna be like, "Hey, so and so is gonna go under a renovation during your program." So they give more insight. Um, but they are that extension of y- you know, sales for independent hotels primarily.
4:32
And I keep saying primarily because some of these hotels are branded, but they're like franchised. You know? So they kinda have a weird...
4:41
They, they don't fit independent, but they don't fit like the, you know, f- like a full service Marriott. Um, all in all, they need more help getting, you know- Okay... promoting themselves, marketing themselves. So.
4:54
Well, the hotel pays them to do- It-... to market on their behalf. Yeah. Yeah.
4:58
The hotel pays and like I try, like I tried to get some more information on that, but that's, [laughs] I- So basically they're a marketing company for hotels. Well, marketing- And maybe they'll be selling as well...
5:08
and sales. Okay. Because they, yeah, because they will follow up. They will submit RFPs on your behalf. You know what I mean? Okay. They will connect. So it is a little bit more involved than just marketing. Okay.
5:21
And, and then she said, now I'm just, I'm just like, uh, you know what, I'm just trying to be clear here because I remember I haven't, um, I've never utilized, I, well, I think I have.
5:34
I've utilized, uh, an Al Hi property once or twice. Um, but I, you know, it just happened to be, I just happened to find out later that this was an Al Hi property. Mm-hmm.
5:44
Um, but I didn't go through a representative to, to help me find it. But from what my understanding was, if you did go through them, um, then there's a commission somewhere, and you're saying that that's not true?
5:58
There's a commission like they get part of the commission that, that I would normally get. You know what I mean? And this is just what I remember, and this was several years ago. Oh my gosh.
6:07
So you're saying that what you would normally get, so you wouldn't get the commission, they would? Is that what you're saying? They would get a portion of it. Huh.
6:14
Like say if it was a, if I was due t- say 10%, they would get a percentage off of my 10%. Gotcha. Because they helped out with, uh, you know, whatever. Right. Oh, see, I don't know if it changed or what.
6:29
I don't know if I- Well, did you ask that? That's what I asked you to ask. Well, well, well, no, I'm, so that's what I'm, I'm level setting.
6:34
I, I don't know if it's changed, but when I specifically asked do you guys get paid commission, it was no. They are salaried, you know, employees of ALHI. Okay, but someone has to pay them somewhere. Right.
6:48
So maybe the commission goes back to ALHI. Right. But I- But not necessarily... when I- I don't, you know, but z- But I d- I don't think it's a commission. I, so- Okay...
6:56
and even so, you know, I asked her, I said, "What, what would be my advantage to ALHI?" I need a ALHI person on here right here- Right... right now. What's her name again? [laughs] As many times as I said her name.
7:08
[laughs] Kimberly DeVries? DeVries. [laughs] Kimberly DeVries, you're welcome to come on here. Let's talk about it. Let's discuss it. Let's do it. You know? L- we'll get you right here in the middle of us, okay?
7:19
You, you know what? You're not taking my word for it. I think that's the problem. I told you I asked this question. I told you they don't get commission, and you don't believe me. You know what?
7:26
You did, yeah, because she, it's third-hand information by the time it gets to me. You know what I mean? Yeah. So I don't know. That's right. All right. Yeah. You could be right.
7:33
I mean, you, you could be right, but I just need some- Maybe... maybe I have some other question that you can't answer. Okay. All right. You know what I mean? Uh, okay?
7:40
You don't know everything about it just 'cause you had lunch with somebody [laughs] with ALHI. You know what I mean? [laughs] And, and this is true, Malik.
7:47
[laughs] I didn't know you were that invested in whether they taking commissions or not, like I think- But this is... Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, back up here.
7:57
I- in the world, well, see, you don't live in the world that I live in, okay? Right. Right. Okay?
8:02
So in the world that w- we live in, meaning, uh, people like myself that, um, they, their livelihood is our commissions, right? Yeah. And someone's taking a portion of it. Yeah. Oh, believe me, we remember that.
8:16
And, and, um, like I said, maybe things have changed, 'cause I don't know, 'cause I have not had a conversation with anyone from ALHI in a while, in, in several years. Sure.
8:26
So I don't know if I'm, uh, if I'm completely right or completely wrong. I'm not sure where I am on this. Um, okay? [laughs] So, and I'll be [laughs] here.
8:36
I, that's why I said, hey, if someone, if one, if someone from ALHI wants to come on here, I mean, you're welcome. The door is open, okay?
8:44
Come on here and we can discuss it because, or we can just have a conversation, not necessarily a discussion. It is what it is, right? Right.
8:50
And I just wanna know what, what it is, because there's a lot of planners like myself, independent planners, that, um, you know, that we may do business with ALHI Properties, but, you know, if, if ALHI doesn't help us, then what?
9:04
But if you ask them to, "Hey, can you help me with this?
9:07
I, I need an in on this property, and I'm trying to get this, I'm trying to get that," then once you're in, they're, you're invested in them, or vested in them, then, uh, then maybe it's rightfully so that a commission does go to them because they helped you with it.
9:21
And I understand that, okay? I'm not o- opposed to that, but I just wanna know upfront what the heck ALHI does, 100% of what they do. That's it. Boom. Yeah. Okay. I hear you. So that's fair.
9:32
You don't survive off commission, okay? No, I- You don't survive- I use them as a, a, well, to, to- And I don't understand why you don't get that little commission every now and then... you know what?
9:42
That's, that's, that's a whole other tale for a different day, I guess. Um, but yeah, you know, all in all, different, another resource. That, I guess that was my, uh, my point to that. Yeah.
9:52
Oh, yeah, it's, it's, they're definitely a resource, and I, yeah. Yeah. Definitely that. Definitely that. And great lunch. And, and, and memorable because I will, I will connect, [laughs]
10:01
I will connect them to that memorable, delicious lunch. And I'm always a pro- pro- proponent of relationship building over meals. Yeah. It's all about that. It's all about that lunch. It's all about that meal deal.
10:12
I know. I know. If I can get me a meal deal here, I'm happy. Oh, come on. Come on. You're making me- I just said if I can get that meal deal, I'm happy.
10:19
I just said that Well, we know what your meal is, so we won't go there anymore. All I need, all I need... Hey, just so you guys know, let me just tell you, okay?
10:29
If you see me at a conference or whatever, um, you see me like- Okay... "Oh, that's Russell. Oh, you know, we, I, I- Don't do it...
10:36
I, I need to get to know him, see what his businesses are and all this, what he does and all this stuff," okay? All I need, okay? [laughs] You see me at the bar. Okay? You see me sitting at the bar.
10:46
All I need is some french fries and a beer. That's it. [laughs] Okay? I'm- On a cheat day. [laughs] I'm so upset that you're sticking to that.
10:54
[laughs] Like, I, I feel like that was maybe at the time, but you are seriously can be bought for f- french fries and a beer. Yeah. And what did I do? Did I end up sitting in the RFP meeting? You sure did. I sure did.
11:06
I sure did. Oh, people need to be listening. And it, it wasn't all about the fries and the beer, but that made me open up, you know?
11:13
That opens up, and then I say, "Okay, what do I have that I can possibly send to this person?" I tell you. And, and I had the, she gave me some hotels. I'm like, "Oh, shoot.
11:22
For this group, this would be ideal for this group." We ended up not booking it, but, not booking it at one of their properties, but, you know, I, an RFP was sent, and for two properties, so two different properties.
11:35
So, uh, it just didn't happen, but they ended up choosing another destination. Yeah. Uh, it wasn't about the hotels. It was, it was basically about the destination, so. Uh, but yeah. No, yeah.
11:45
But all it took was, all it took was a beer, cold beer. I guess it was two, two beers. It was two cold beers. Oh, oh, oh. It was two. It was two. Let's be specific. Two beers. It was two. It was two. And french fries.
11:55
And some little bit of french fries. Not even a full meal. Not even no truffle fries, just regular fries. [laughs] Just regular fries. Yeah, just regular fries with some salt on them. Oh my gosh.
12:04
You know, maybe the salt was sea salt. I don't remember. But yeah. [laughs] You're making me look bad. I'm like, man, we have to go to this nice restaurant. The service is elevated.
12:13
Put Russell at the bar, slap some fries in front of his face, and keep that beer coming. Exactly. Not even coming. Just two beers- Yeah... he's out anyways, so. Yeah. Two beers, I'm out.
12:22
[laughs] I'm done after two beers, so. That's it. See? That's all it takes. Yeah. That's all it takes to have that c- a meaningful conversation with me, okay?
12:29
Well, the point is- And hopefully you get a, an RFP out of it The point is, is to have it. To, to, to, to mark time to do it.
12:37
So whether it's, you know, following up, whether it's, you know, an email saying, "Hey, do you wanna do this?" Whether it's, you know, getting together before and after a conference. Yes. Just do it.
12:48
It's all about building that relationship, right? You know? Yeah. It's all about building that rapport, that relationship, uh, and that can lead to things.
12:55
I mean, yeah, we're joking about it and it's funny, blah, blah, blah, but that's how it works though, right? I mean- Right...
13:00
um, uh, Kimberly taking you to lunch and, yeah, I mean, you're, it's memorable 'cause you've been talking about it. I mean, off air you were talking about it.
13:09
Um- Now you're talking about it again, so it was definitely memorable, right? Yeah. So you're gonna use, when the opportunity comes up, you're gonna use Kimberly and, and ALHI.
13:18
And we've talked about ALHI about 10 times already on this show. Yeah. So, so there you go. Well, and then, and it just, um, it keeps, and I, we've said this before, it keeps you top of mind. Yes.
13:29
Because the amount of planning that we do- Oh my... especially as a independent planners, you have- Awesome... different programs for different clients. Mm-hmm. And you're like, "Wait,
13:38
you know, who do I, who do I know that does that?" And then all of a sudden you remember that lunch event you had last week. "Oh yeah, they do do this." Yeah. So and then just not getting lost in the shuffle.
13:48
An email doesn't cut it. An email after a conference of yes, of course, we want that follow-up, and then now we're on your newsletter, but then it gets shuffled in all the other emails.
13:58
What, you know, what, what you want it set apart is that meaningful exchange, you know? And it happens for me over a meal. If it happens for you, it's beer and french fries. Whatever it- Hello. Hello. Hello...
14:15
just do it. [laughs] Hello. [laughs] Just do it. That, that's my whole point. [laughs] Yeah. So okay. So, um... Wait a minute. Damn it.
14:26
It was something like, something that you said that I was gonna jump on or chime in on. Um, dang it. Dang it. It, it'll come back to me. It'll come back to me. Oh, yeah. Okay. So, um, so what else? Okay.
14:39
So now that we talked about that, the ALHI thing and whatever, whatever, what else? What else is on your mind? So, yeah. So that was my feel-good Friday. But, um- Feel-good Friday...
14:50
during the week, and you know, I was bringing this up to you because I, and I've brought this up to you before, my frustrations about, um,
14:59
huh, you know, communicating with, with sales managers on, you know, different properties. And you know, and I said I was gonna say this, but I'll go ahead and say it.
15:08
It's, it's very inconsistent when I reach out to see if a program is going to fit for this hotel venue, and I don't get what I need right off.
15:18
And usually it's, "Yes, we have that date available," and, you know, "Here's the minimum. Do you wanna go to contract?" And I'm like, "Whoa, whoa. Whoa." You know?
15:27
So a lot of times it's like, you know, the floor plan's not included, the setup's not included. I don't know how I, you know, want... And i- it's a lot of this back and forth.
15:37
Um, and then I thought about, you know, the past few days, that when I do these, you know, one-day events that don't require rooms, for the most part, maybe about 80% of the time I am connected to the catering manager.
15:51
And I've noticed the difference between, uh, communicating with a catering manager versus a sales manager, and that's that missing link.
15:59
I don't get the information I need from the catering manager until we're talking about the F&B. [laughs] Then they're all like- Hmm... they, you know, they wanna hop on a call.
16:09
They wanna, you know, get the program great. But, um, the, that initial contact between, you know, proposal and contract differs so widely between the catering manager and a sales manager.
16:26
And me, as a planner, I wish that that training or however they do it, their process, was consistent. So you're saying there's a difference between,
16:38
uh, uh, working with a sales manager and working with a catering manager? Is that- Yes... is that what I'm hearing? Yes. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Okay. At least it is on me, on, on, on my end for programs.
16:49
Very rarely and, and, do I get a catering manager that just really hones in on the details of what I need- Mm-hmm... as far as the room and the diagram. It's, it's only when I am, you know, asking questions. And
17:08
I don't know. It's... I, look, Russell, I'm not from the hotel background, so I don't know the process. I just know what I want to see when I ask for a proposal. [laughs] Okay. Okay. I, you know what? I j- I, it's funny.
17:25
I mean, funny, peculiar, odd, whatever. Um, I have that same experience sometime when- Hmm... when I'm dealing with, when I'm... Because it's the, the number of rooms, right? So- Right... the difference between
17:40
if it's gonna go to a sales manager or go to a catering manager is the number of guest rooms, okay? Sure.
17:47
So 10 rooms or more is considered a group, so there's someone in the sales, you know, even if it's a sales assistant, sales coordinator, whatever, somebody's gonna handle that, right?
17:57
'Cause you have s- 10 rooms or more, then you have some meeting space, okay? Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Okay. On the other end, catering, they're more responsible for the rooms.
18:05
I mean, the meeting rooms, the, the space, the event- Right... space and all that, and less concerned about the guest rooms.
18:12
So I don't know if there's a training issue or an excitement issue, but I, I don't, I don't [laughs]
18:21
I really don't know because I've worked, I mean, I've had catering people under me, and they're the same, they're the same as, as a, doesn't matter what side of the table I'm sitting on- Mm-hmm... they're the same.
18:34
And I, and I hate to, like, generalize every-... catering manager out there, 'cause not all of them are the same.
18:40
But the ones that I've, obviously the ones you've come across and the ones that I've come across, they're underwhelming. Okay? They're not there to help you through the process or, or sell you- Right...
18:52
or, I mean, not even necessarily selling, it's just asking the right questions. Like, okay- Right... what, what do you need on this? Can I help you with this? Uh, did you need help with... Did you think about this?
19:02
You know, uh, our space can do this. Let me send you something so you can see what our space, our actual space looks like. Not a, not one of those links where you can simply- Oh my gosh. That's another thing, Russell.
19:13
The, the interactive map and images and... [sighs] Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, so yeah. So you're not, I'll just say you're not alone in that. Um, and you know, maybe you need to, you know, offer more guest rooms.
19:28
You know, you know what I mean? Then that way you don't have to talk to them. [laughs] Got you. [laughs] I need to change my ways so I can get better. [laughs] Oh, man. Thank you. There's the solution. But yeah.
19:39
But no, that's not the solution. Yeah. No, it's, it's interesting. And you know, even with the breakdown, and you know, keep me honest 'cause I'm, you know, again, not in the hotel world.
19:49
But you know, you got your sales manager who owns the contract, so we're ironing out the details.
19:54
And I get it, they're may not, they may not know everything that I need to know, and then they'll, you know, connect me with the event manager. Fine. You know? Or conference services, fine. Um,
20:06
but when you have, I guess, catering manager who's handling the entire process, the hotel, the contract, as well as, um, you know, event services, that's when it gets dicey. Because
20:19
you're not giving me enough information to make a decision that this fits for my program. Mm. So you know, maybe having people that just own what they do. If it's the sales manager, I... You know, it is what it is.
20:31
Sales manager, I get it. They control, you know, the rooms contract, and then you have someone else that controls, from what I'm understanding from you, um, meeting space o- o- only.
20:43
But at the same time, if you are the owner of that meeting space, like, and we've said this before, you are the expert in that. Share with me all what I need to know of that meeting space.
20:53
So if I'm telling you I have this 50-person program that needs to, you know, have certain room constraints, give me that room, plus how would it look like in that room. You know? Mm-hmm.
21:04
We've talked about, you know, doing things and booking site unseen. Mm-hmm.
21:09
And when I communicate that I'm not on s- I'm not able to do a site, so can you s- show me based on my AV needs, based on the specs of, uh, what the room, what, what the setup needs to be.
21:22
What does that look like in your room? Russell, I don't so, so much get a, a room picture or a photo sometimes, [laughs] let alone a room diagram. [laughs] And I get that s- that silly link you just talked about.
21:35
Oh, you can go on our virtual tour. Oh my gosh. If I hear that one more time. [laughs] Oh. Whoever, whoever sold the hotel industry on these virtual tours just needs to be fired.
21:48
It's does not- [laughs] They did not ask any planner how this would look. [laughs] It's awful, Russell. Oh. It is awful. You over here trying to find the... I mean, you know, we're so meticulous on space.
22:02
We need to see every... You, and I get it, you wanna see, but you're, you're, you're doing these tours and you're, you're clicking, and then it doesn't click all the way. Oh my god, it's just awful.
22:13
At this point, like last week I was like, "Give me a static photo." [laughs] 'Cause she- Mm... kept sending me [laughs] Mm...
22:20
this like, oh, you know, this ballroom, here's the link to that and then you can, you know, view it here. I... Look, I need a static photo. [laughs] I need to see if it has pillars.
22:31
I need to see what, what it looks like. Mm. Yeah, I mean- Give me a room setup. I mean, we've been talking this until, um, you know, forever. Give me some examples of how it's set up.
22:42
You do how many, you know, meetings a year. Yeah. Do a quick room setup. Show it to me. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. They, they are the experts on this. Yeah.
22:51
They should know how every setup would look, and they should already have in their arsenal of whatever, emails that they can just quickly send to you, photos or whatever- Yeah... this set up or whatever.
23:03
Not something, like I say, and not something that's, uh, they have to d- the planner has to do the work and go to some link- Oh... that, that doesn't really show, um, what they're looking for, right? I mean, yeah. Yes.
23:14
It may show, it may show that room, but now you have to click over here to fo- so to go here, and then click over here to go here. And then all this kinda chasing this with your mouse and all that kind of stuff.
23:25
I mean, that's- What is wrong with- That's not selling. Okay? Hello, that's not selling. That's not making it easy for a plan- that's on the phone right now that obviously wants to book with you. Okay? Right.
23:37
That's the thing. We get people on the hook and we let them off. We let them off because we're throwing too many obstacles in their way, okay? Mm-hmm. And I'll just say that.
23:47
There's a lot of obstacles out there, and it doesn't have to be that hard, right? Right. You know, you know what they're looking for 'cause they just told you, right? Do you, can you do it, yes or no?
23:57
I mean, what have you done in that space? How creative can you be? I mean, let the planner know how creat- oh, we can do this.
24:05
Oh, we just recently did, you know, that particular setup for this one gr- I happen to have a photo. Let me show this to you. Let me show it to you. Whatever. I mean, just offer suggestions because you are the expert.
24:16
This person doesn't know. They never been there before. They're doing this site unseen. So sometimes I think we have to take it from that standpoint that no, they've never seen this space before.
24:26
They've never been in this hotel before. They're not gonna come here, so I have to be their eyes. You know what I mean? I mean, that's sometimes- Yeah... they have to do that. You know what you just said?
24:37
The, it, it, it, just explaining the excitement is something that I did not experience with-... any of these sales, sales people. And I, and I'm wondering if the business has just become,
24:51
I, I don't wanna say transactional, but it's become such like robotic. You know? Mm-hmm. That the, the lead comes in and they're like, "Yes, we have space for 50 people. Here's what it is." I've never...
25:04
I've yet to encounter a sales manager be like, "We can do this, and this." You know, "How, how is your event? Can you, you know, explain a little bit more?" No. It's literally [laughs] it's a, it's a reply back.
25:16
[laughs] It's a date available. You know, it's literally like bullet points. And, and I don't know. What, what's going on there? Is it- Now, are these conversations you're on the phone or is this, uh, strictly email?
25:30
It's initially email. It's initially email. Um, but even, even follow-up conversations. I will say, you know, I know we talked about catering managers and, you know, how they're so different than sales managers.
25:45
I had a catering manager last week. Mm-hmm. Um, and I said, "Hey, let's get on a, on a call," because she asked me some questions. And she gets on that call and she's just sh- she's just great.
25:57
She's just like, "Look, let me explain some things to you. This is how we can set up." I mean, she knew her things. "Oh, well, you know what?
26:04
I know you want buffet out here, but we have a great little, little nook here that I think will be great for your group."
26:09
And you know, when we s- that's why I said, when we start talking about the food and beverage, and the set up, they were, they were great about it.
26:16
Now, didn't, did she get my, you know, diagrams or floor plans and all that? You know, I had to fight for that. But once we got into her wheelhouse of, [laughs] of catering, they lit up.
26:27
So that's to my point, there's that missing link between that initial sales process of getting that, getting, uh, you know, getting that sale, right? 'Cause sometimes, you know, we have, I don't know, you know,
26:43
I don't know, what, a few options, and I'm thinking I wanna go here, but it's like pulling teeth with the sales manager.
26:50
And so it's like, hmm, you know, maybe this property doesn't work as well, but I had a great relationship with the sales manager, and they, they see the vision of the program.
27:00
So maybe you lost the business because of your lackluster, you know, attitude or whatever. [laughs] Hmm. You know what I mean? Hmm. So I don't know. I'm just kinda putting it out there.
27:10
Is it, is it hard out there for salespeople now? Is it? Is it tough out there- That they have to be robotic?... for a sales manager? [laughs] I, I d- [laughs]
27:21
I, I, I don't, I, I, I can't answer that question, is it, is it tough out there? Um, uh, I mean, that's, to me, that's just doing, well, it's just doing your job, but it's how you do your job, right? Yeah.
27:35
I mean, it's your job. Are you excited about it? Are you excited about your job? I mean, I guess everybody gets in a rut, you know what I mean? Right.
27:42
But this is someone calling, and y- y- you're, like I said, how- whatever bait they had to put out there, they got you on the hook, okay? Sure. They got you on the hook. And you don't let that person get off the hook.
27:55
Or just like you don't let the fish get off the hook, right? Yeah. You're doing everything you can to reel them in. If that means that you gotta...
28:01
'Cause salespeople, if you're a true salesperson, you can be as fake as you need to be- [laughs]... to get that piece of business, okay? If you- [laughs]
28:10
If you, [laughs] if you, I mean, as you said, you gotta turn it on and turn it off whenever you need to. Yeah. Right? So- Yeah...
28:15
if that, that charm that you're looking for, I, I'm reading you as to what you want, right? Mm-hmm. So I'm gonna read you. And whatever you want, i- if I want that piece of business, I'm gonna give it to you, right?
28:26
If that means, you know, you're, you're, you're kinda upbeat and I'm not, at that point like, "Oh my God, you know what? We could do this. We could do that."
28:33
You know, I'm gonna read off of you the, the energy that you have, right? Right.
28:37
So, um, but maybe they're not good on, you know, uh, realizing that, or they're, they're not good at, at, at noticing that this person needs someone that's a little bit upbeat. Not everybody's gonna be like that, right?
28:51
Right. But as a salesperson, as a good salesperson, you have to read that person and see what's going on with them. Yeah. And then, but then, then how do you ease into this? Start asking questions about them.
29:04
Or, "This g- uh, this is your first time here? Have you, you know, have you booked-" Yeah... "in Chicago before? Or do you, are you local to here? Are you b-" I mean, all those things, you have to get to know them first.
29:17
And then, believe me, things get a lot easier, or if there's tension, the tension will go down. Right. And now it's just ha- like having a conversation with someone.
29:26
And that's where you want, as a salesperson, you want conversations, it, selling to be like a conversation. Not like hard sale, this and that. This, this line, you, we can't cross this line or whatever.
29:39
No, that's not what you want, 'cause everyone doesn't receive that well, okay? I would hang up and go somewhere else, okay? Exactly.
29:47
So, and that's obviously, that's where we are here with you, where you're on that fence like- Hmm... you know, sometimes you may need that hotel because of the location and whatever, but you're trying every,
30:00
ev- you know, every b- being, every within you is you're trying to find another place, you know what I mean? Yeah.
30:05
Because that person is not, you know, they're not on board, or they're not resonating with you, or you don't have that good rapport that you had with the last person, or last hotel or, or whatever the case may be.
30:17
But I don't think the j- the job is the job, okay? Right, right. I think it depends on the individual person. And like I said, I, the, the difference between a catering manager and a sales manager.
30:29
'Cause normally, okay, so a sales manager gets it, right? Goes, it's 10 rooms or more, blah, blah, blah. I, I mentioned that earlier. Okay. But once that contract is signed, it goes to a convention services person.
30:41
Mm-hmm. Who, a convention services person could be half a catering manager and half a salesperson, because they deal with rooms and they deal with space. Mm-hmm. Okay?
30:50
They deal with AV, they deal with all that stuff, right? And they're a little bit more detailed in what they deal with, right?
30:56
At least the, the good ones that I've worked with, they're detailed, but they, they, they can be both. They can be a sales manager, room sales, or they can be a catering person.
31:05
They're kinda 50% one or the, and, and the other. So, um, but if you, when you get a true s- a catering manager [laughs] sometimes, and that can mean the, the size of the hotel, you know- Yeah...
31:18
you're dealing with or whatever. Um, sometimes it can be c- it, it... And I hate to say this. I mean, it can be kinda dicey. It can be kinda, you know, hot and cold. I mean, 'cause I've experienced the same stuff.
31:30
I mean, that's... And so there has to be something with that, I don't know if it's the training or the lack thereof. Yeah. But, um, I, I don't know.
31:38
But even when I work with catering managers, they were different than the, the [laughs] conference services person and a s- a, a room salesperson. Okay. Interesting.
31:50
And I'm glad we're talking about this, that I'm not the only one, because it's just this vast difference and, um- You are not alone. [laughs] Oh, boy. I am not. [laughs] Yes. No. Yeah. You are not alone in that.
32:03
You're not alone in that. Yeah. Other people would say the same thing. Other people in our positions, [clears throat] would probably say the same things.
32:09
I mean, and, and the, and that's why it's good to have these conversations- Mm-hmm... and just see what w- what we're dealing with. Because people think, you know, on our side, "Oh, it's easy.
32:18
Blah, blah, blah," you know? No. Because sometimes the people that we're, that are supposedly selling us or whatever we're doing business with, they don't make it easy. Right. Right.
32:28
They don't make it easy when it can be. That... What you're talking about should be a slam dunk, okay?
32:34
Okay, you're giving them the business, it's just that now they're making it hard because they're not being forthcoming with the information. You have- Yeah...
32:43
you need more information in order for you to book it there, to be 100% confident, right? Absolutely. You need more information, but it's like pulling teeth. They should volunteer this information.
32:54
They should be- Well, and that's my point... reaching out. You are doing more of the selling than some of these catering managers that I'm talking to. We could do this. So, and, and it's not even...
33:03
I mean, you had mentioned about, you know, energy and being... Y- I, like, you can have the same energy. You can be as introverted as you want.
33:11
But y- tell me about your space and how it's gonna work for my program, bottom li- bottom line. That's it. How- however you wanna do it. If you wanna do song and dance, cool. [laughs] If you wanna just...
33:22
You know what I mean? I don't care how it's delivered. [laughs] Yeah. Yeah. But tell me, because I feel like I am, sometimes I feel like I'm bothering you. Mm. Like, "Hey- Mm... what about this?" Mm.
33:34
And I'm a client, and I'm paying my bills, you know? So, [laughs] like the money- Mm. You, you got the money. Yeah. You got the check. Mm-hmm.
33:40
Um, but if you're not telling me about the parking, "Hey, the parking is covered. Hey, it's a host of parking." "Oh, okay." "Just so you know, we provide valet, you know, like this.
33:52
We pr- provide a validation or someone will be here." I have to ask, "What is the process in that?" Instead of you just putting it on the, you know, the event order. Okay, you're gonna cover it. Okay.
34:03
But do they need to have something stamped? Do they... C- give me the information. You do this. Yes. Yeah. This is not your first program at, at this hotel. [laughs] Not, not really.
34:12
So- It's your first program at that hotel. Exactly. And that's how they sh- But y- yeah. They should always take it from that standpoint. This is her first time here. She's never been here, blah, blah, blah.
34:22
And, and, and, and what people don't re- I would be selling to you like you have 10 other groups in back of this one. Please do. Okay?
34:32
[laughs] That's, and that's the thing that people tend to forget, that everybody wants to work on that ne- ne- next piece of business, right? Mm-hmm. A new client, a new...
34:41
If you take care of the client in front of you, you don't know how much business is behind there. You know what I mean? Yes. Absolutely.
34:48
So, and that's, and that's, I think that's the, that could be a disconnect or, because people are always trying to work on, um, the next client. I gotta get to the next client. Right. No.
34:57
This, this client right here could be your next client. This, this p- client right here could represent- Absolutely... another 16 programs. You know what I mean? Absolutely. You don't know. You don't know.
35:08
So we just returned to a, um, an existing location, um, this last week. And when I tell you it was a breeze. S- "Hey, can we get the same room?" "Absolutely." "Hey, you know the AV setup."
35:21
AV guy said, "Hey, I got your event order from last year. Same. Anything change?" Like, the AV person schedules a call with me. Now mind you, AV should be one of the things you could take care of via email of all things.
35:33
Exactly. AV guy calls me and says, "Hey, just wanna verify that it's the same program. You know our guys are coming in here, this and that. Nothing changed?" "Absolutely." I mean, what a five-minute call.
35:45
But the, the level of them wanting to give that service and wanting to just make sure, I appreciate it. Mm-hmm.
35:52
The, uh, the event ma- oh, and thank goodness, Russell, the event manager is the same person, 'cause that's another thing. It could be the s- [laughs] same video- Mm-hmm... but different person. Yeah.
36:01
So now we have to, it's still repeating a lot of things. So, a- and the event was so seamless. Um, he, he was like, "Hey, you know, are we gonna do the same thing?" "Hey, let me go over the event order from last year."
36:14
He even said, "Um, well, I, I remember the guests really liked this particular, uh, food package from last year. Do you wanna do the same thing?" Wow. 'Cause I forgot. I mean, I do 30 of these.
36:24
I don't know what we order for food. It just needs to be there. Mm-hmm. And I said, "Sure." I, and sure enough, when we did the survey, food was delicious. Food was excellent. [laughs] So- Mm.
36:35
You know, I, it was such, it was so refreshing to have someone that, you know, not only knew your program, but was excited for you guys to come back, you know? And you felt that.
36:47
[clears throat] And I even, you know, even said, "Hey, once I get my dates for next year, this location, I'm reaching out." And he said- Mm-hmm..., "I appreciate that." Yeah.
36:55
Um, you always talking about how the hotel and the inn should, you know, try to get that next year's business. So, um, that's still, I don't know, that's on them.
37:03
But I just appreciate, you know, when you do have something that you can repeat how, how seamless it is, you know? Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. But- Mm-hmm, mm-hmm... but, you know, that's the planner side.
37:19
On the hotel side, hey, yeah, absolutely reach out. Reach out to me and say, "Hey, are you gonna be doing the same program next year?" I'm, I'm, I'm candid about it. I'll, like, I'll talk to you.
37:29
I'll say, "Hey, yeah, you know. Oh, keep us in mind. Do you want me to reach out, you know, around this time next year?" See, that would be great. Mm. If they said- It-..., "Hey, should I schedule a time to reach out?"
37:42
Yes. Absolutely. Yeah. I'm not gonna do it. [laughs] I'm not gonna remember to schedule the time. [laughs] Yes, yes. We know. We know. It- [laughs] Yeah. And they should do that. Yeah.
37:54
And they can, they have the capability of doing that. I mean- Sure... you know, everybody has technology these days, and even if you don't, you just trace out the card, the old-fashioned filing system card.
38:06
Just trace it out for that next date, for next year- Okay... or whatever it is, six months from now or whatever. But- Put it, look, put it on your Outlook calendar. Say, "Reach out." Well, however you wanna do it.
38:16
Exactly. If you have the capabilities to know the entire event program from last year, you have capabilities to schedule a follow-up call during that same time period, you know? Yeah. Exactly. I, yeah, I, I agree.
38:29
We're on the same page today, Miss Tiffany, okay? Mm, mm. So hey, this is, uh, the Daily Check-In with Russell, uh, Russell of Hotels and Miss Tiffany. She comes in on Mondays and she gives us a piece of her mind.
38:42
Obviously that's what she's doing today. [laughs] You know. Uh, today's topic was what's, what catering salespeople are doing wrong. [laughs] Wow. See, I knew you were gonna twist it i- to, to be negative.
38:54
[laughs] No, we share things. I mean, obviously these are things that are, that she's working on right now, okay? Right. This is something that just happened last week, so- Right... of course we want things that, um...
39:07
W- we're trying to make sure if you don't know, if people don't know what they're doing wrong, well, they need to, they need to be checked every now and then, okay? So these are things that she's experiencing.
39:17
And these things are based on Tiffany's experiences, okay? These are not things that we're just making up- Right... like, uh, we just read them somewhere or someone else told us.
39:26
No, these are things that she's dealing with on a daily basis. And, um, salespeople are not, you know, it, it's not, um, you know, like, it, it... What am I trying to say? Um,
39:41
if you have a client on the phone, a potential client- Mm-hmm... you get as much information as you can from them first and foremost, but you're giving them information as well about how you set things up, right?
39:53
This is how it works. It shouldn't be pulling teeth, right? It's should, you should be forthcoming with the information. Make the process easy. You have this person on the hook, okay? Reel them in, okay? Reel them in.
40:06
Yes. But don't let them off the hook because you let them off the hook, they're going somewhere else, and that's not what you want. Right.
40:11
And Tiffany represents, like, at least 30 programs over the, uh, you know, a year. Maybe- Yeah... yeah, uh, maybe in six months. I don't know.
40:18
But, um, but she represents a lot of business, and people are missing the, they're missing out. They're missing out. Aw. It's okay. That's nice. The, but, uh, you know- [laughs]...
40:29
you, you, you're making all these great points about how, you know, we're onto the next if we don't get what we need from that. But y- you have us on the hook, and I say us as planners.
40:41
You have us on the hook, but, you know, as soon as you're saying, "Here's a quote and here's what it is. Do you wanna go to contract?" I'm just like, "Oh, come on. You got a little...
40:51
Give me a little more first," you know? Mm-hmm. Uh, uh, clearly, and I'm one of the planners, I don't reach out unless there's an interest. I don't, I don't have time for shopping.
41:00
You know, I'm not doing all these multiple quotes.
41:02
If I'm doing, sending an RFP, getting information availability, it's because we've already, and talking about my team, already have talked about going to your location, okay? I just wanna make that clear.
41:14
Like, these are [laughs] these are, what, what do you call them? Warm, hot leads. Whatever it is. This is not- Yeah, warm or hot. Okay. Steaming. Yeah. So you, you're, you're h- I'm, I'm halfway there.
41:26
I just need you to, you pull me in, and you're not doing that when you say, "Are you ready to go to contract? Here's the, here's the quote." I don't even have a... W- what, what is the room? [laughs] Exactly.
41:37
Like, what, what- Exactly... what are the details? Mm-hmm. And you know what?
41:39
Speaking of this, and this is bare bed, minimum, you know, that I, I want, but if I had my whole, you know, if I had my choice and I had everything, my wish list, um, give me some destination information.
41:54
Give, paint a picture of where your hotel stands, you know? If I say, uh, you know, uh, New Orleans, I, you know, I had a conversation with someone in New Orleans and she just marveled over her hotel.
42:05
She says, "Oh, Tiffany, you're..." Like, she had me wanting to book. You know how I feel about New Orleans, so I was like, "Yeah, I'll go there." She had me ready to book that day to go check out her h- hotel.
42:15
The way she was painting a picture. It's, "Oh, it's, it's so accessible, and we just had a brand-new renovation, and, you know, it's really easy to get to, and, you know, the, um, the streetcar stops right in front."
42:26
Give me that passion about your hotel that we're interested in going. So that's, I'm not gonna say above and beyond, but can we include that as well? [laughs] Can we... You know? Yeah. I mean, that- Right?
42:42
That's gonna, like you said, if that's gonna get you the booking, I mean, I'll bring all kind of stuff. [laughs] I mean, that, that's the key.
42:49
That, I mean, that, like, like you said, that's the difference between a good sales manager and, well, one that's not good. They're offering all this other information that you may- Mm-hmm...
42:58
not have asked for, but you know they know that it's pertinent to your meeting, to the suc- the success of your meeting. Yeah. They know that, right?
43:06
Maybe they've done their research on you, or maybe this is what they do with everyone, and that's fine, right? Um, 'cause you don't know. You just know how it made you feel, right? Right. So, so yeah.
43:17
So n- sometimes we gotta pull out everything, all the stops, if you will, right? But, um- Of course. I mean, you're competing. Hotels need to, and they- [clears throat]...
43:25
they have to understand they're not the only one on [laughs] you know- Yeah... option right there... beat them down. Yeah, that and the- So
43:33
w- w- what's gonna make me wanna choose your hotel versus another, um, not even y- I mean, yes, of course I want that great working relationship, but again, if we're, you know, not on site, paint that picture of why you're the perfect hotel, not only, you know, as far as helping with that program, but lo- location.
43:55
Um, e- even a- another option too is, you know, there's a lot of, uh, you know, a few months ago, a lot of things going on, um, you know, politically and, you know, there was, um, you know, protests and things like that.
44:09
So there was one location we were looking at, and I said, "Hey, I gotta be honest. Where, where are you located, and is, will there be any issues?"
44:16
And she got on the phone with me and explained like, "Look, this is what we're facing. You know, there's been a lot of media black- backlash, but no, we're in this location." And sometimes you have to do that.
44:26
Sometimes you have to paint that picture of what your hotel looks like. Mm. And that's another of the reason why I love sales managers who are on property, 'cause that's a whole other thing. [laughs] Mm.
44:37
That's a whole other discussion. [laughs] Um, but local and on property that can paint what your- Yes... hotel looks like today. Exactly. Not when you went and visited two weeks ago. [laughs] Yes. [laughs] Yes, yes, yes.
44:52
Okay, so based on that, what you just said, [clears throat] would you not book at a hotel i- because the sales manager is not on property? I'm not... Yeah, so for you, I, I'm not saying I wouldn't book.
45:07
No, that's not, that's not a deal-breaker. Okay. But the, it's just much more important to know your stuff. Okay.
45:15
Because I h- I've had, I've talked to sales managers who were not on property, and I asked them about parking because we, you know, put in the communication for people how to park, and the sales manager said, "Well, I really don't know, but it's right there next door."
45:31
I'm like, "Yeah, yeah, yeah, but when you drive up, you know, 'cause I noticed there's a shopping center, so when you drive up, you gotta..." "I really don't know." And it frustrated me because if you don't know,
45:43
point me to someone who does, or tell me you're gonna get back to me. So I'm not saying it's a deal breaker, but it's really frustrating if you don't learn your property. Hmm. Hmm. Yeah. Interesting. Yeah.
46:00
What about you? Interesting. I know, I know how you feel about some of these, uh- What, h- what, what? Now you know how I'm thinking now? What are you saying?
46:07
Well, no, I said what about you first, but I know you've, you've had, we've had conversations about sales people not on property. Oh, I bet, you know, yeah, I, I don't like it. I really don't like it. I'm not a big fan.
46:20
Let's put it like that. I'm not a big fan- Yeah... of it, but, um, it's bas- uh, you know, it's, it's the client's decision, right? Right. And a lot of times I don't tell the client that anyway, um,
46:33
because there's someone that services that's there. Only thing I would want is the, an introduction to the person that's gonna be servicing me then. Okay. Yeah. Um, that way it can be somewhat seamless.
46:45
You know, I need a point of contact or whatever, but yeah. I book and put, in fact, Vaya, Vaya Hotel- Yeah... you know that property, right? Yeah. They, they have a nat- I mean, they do, um,
46:57
I don't know what it's called, national sales or whatever, where, you know, the people that you talk to, the salespeople are not on property, right? So they turn it over at a certain point. Okay.
47:07
And I can't rem- remember the person I talked to initially, but she ended up giving me the name of the person, and I actually went in and took a look at the hotel.
47:17
'Cause I wanna make sure that what she was saying on the phone- Yeah... was actually true. [laughs] 'Cause I, you know, w- last thing I need is for my client to show up, 'cause it's one of those, I had never...
47:29
I've been in the hotel when it was another name, 'cause that used to be the Marriott. Marriott, yep. But they redid it and, man, that place, I, I love that hotel now.
47:36
That's my favorite, that's probably my favorite hotel in Orange County, okay? Really? Uh, yes. And the service, oh my God, it was great for the client, and the food was great, and they have options even for me, okay?
47:49
So- Good... I had to go and check it out and just so I knew that the client would be taken care of. And they were, and they love that hotel, and they'll continue to go back.
47:58
But it was, uh, but it all started with that salesperson who, you know, answered the phone that one day or responded to the lead that I sent out, and then called me.
48:06
And we, we had good, you know, relationship or conversation, but like I said, they're not there at the property. And it, and it took me a minute to figure out that she wasn't there.
48:17
See, I was gonna ask you- Before she gave me those questions. Yeah, just like you asked those questions. I was g- Yeah. Yeah. I was gonna ask you if you ask. Do you outright ask? No, I did. I did. Okay.
48:25
I said, "Are you on property?" Yeah. Because there was something I wanted to do. I s- oh, I wanted to come by and look at the property. Yeah. She said, "Well, I'm not, I'm, I'm not gonna be here," something like that.
48:35
[laughs] I said, "Wait, wait, wait." [laughs] I said, "Are you on property?" And she said, "No, I'm remote." I said, "Oh, okay." Oh. So they don't lead with that for the most part. No.
48:45
And maybe you, I, maybe w- you know, even with all my experiences, I should have known. You know what I mean?
48:50
With this is Marriott, and, and probably nine out of 10 properties with Marriott don't have people on property anymore. Yeah. Sales people on property. But I wasn't thinking of that.
49:00
And, uh, and then finally, you know, she said, "Yeah, I'm, I'm not on property, I'm remote." So I'm like, "Okay, can you get me in touch with," [coughs] excuse me, "the person that would show me around?"
49:10
And she did, and we made it happen. Okay. And there you go. So it, it worked, like I said, it worked out really well. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. That's, that is something you have to worry about.
49:22
You know, we've talked about, uh, you know, franchise properties, we talked about, you know, um, hotel management companies, and just the difference that you notice. Um, but- [coughs] Yes... yeah, it's something,
49:34
like you said, to be connected with on-site at the end of the, end, end of the day. And to your point, you have to do your due dil- diligence for your client because- Yes...
49:42
you can't go to your client saying, "Well, I negotiated that in the contract, so that's what it was supposed to be." No, [laughs] they don't care. [laughs] They don't care who you talked to before. Exactly.
49:52
They just want the details right and on-site, so. Exactly. Exactly. Um, but I get it. You do...
49:57
And, again, one of those questions you probably have to bring up because that information does not, it, it's not as transparent as it should be.
50:04
I think, I think hotels are scared that we're gonna, like, you know, not do business with them because they're not on property. So that's why I said it's not a deal breaker. I mean, I still need the property. Yeah.
50:14
But to your point, connect me with the right people to give me that insight. Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah. And that, and that's easy to do, it's just that they have to, well, they ha- just have to do it, right?
50:23
And, and, uh, most of the Marriott people, they've been trained on, 'cause they've dealt with all these questions before. Mm-hmm. You know what I mean? So, and it wa- it's not like they just started doing this.
50:33
It's been some years now. Um, so yeah. So no, they, they, they become good at doing it. Although there was so much backlash be- when they first started it, when they first initi- initiated it.
50:46
Uh, but now, you know, like I said, they're over that hump, and I mean, it, it's common now. Mm-hmm. And, um, yeah. So, so yeah. But it's all about the communication.
50:55
It's all about, you know, giving information and letting people know as well. When they get, get you on the phone, they should tell you immediately, "Hey, just so you know, I'm not on property."
51:04
[laughs] They should, but I, I, I don't see that happening. But yeah, yeah, they won't do that. Yeah. They won't do that. But that's okay. I mean, you know, it, it, it works. It works, so. Right.
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